i think having been a congressman, he's obviously united states senator now. he knows policy. he was a trade rep. he was a white house -- in congress. this guy knows his stuff. but i think interestingly apparently, he's somewhat of a method actor. he listened to tapes, for instance, of the books on tape of barack obama and he's really able to take on the effect and the cadence of the person he's playing. and he, too, has great bedside manner. he's somewhat of a prankster. he develops very warm relationships not only with republicans but democrats have nice things to say about him. >> jennifer: interesting because he was so close to being selected for vice president. i don't know that being a debate stand-in is a good second nod. but president obama is going to be heading to henderson nevada for three days of debate prep behind closed doors. when you and i helped to prepare joe biden i'm curious from your perspective, jill, what was the most surprising thing to you about that whole debate prep? >> that's so interesting. well, i think that debate prep we were at, there was actua